Interview with George Washington Jones, 1984 April 25 [audio](part 1)
- Weddings and housekeeping; Starting families; Playing around and swimming in the Brandywine CreekKeywords: Babies; Baby formula; Brandywine Creek; Celebrations; Diapers; Furniture; Gifts; Houses; Locks; Nursing; Swimming; WeddingsTranscript: Myers: Mr. Jones, when weddings took place, what did the couples get immediately, the things that they needed that were most necessary?
Jones: Well yes, some did. Some had showers and some didn't, you know what I mean, it's just according to how the couple wanted. And they also had church weddings and weddings that the Catholic church up at St. Joe's, St. Joe's on the Brandywine. Some of them were quite big. Most of them went to housekeeping right away on their own. Sometimes they would live with their parents for a short while, but not often, they most went right to housekeeping on their own.
Myers: What things did they get together right away, before they were married, the things that they needed?
Jones: You mean what way did they come together?
Myers: No, no - what things did they get, things that they needed in their home to use - what things that they considered they had to have right away – necessary things in their home?
Jones: A lot of times when they got a shower there would be a kitchen shower, they would mostly get all the pots and pans they needed for that. Usually if a couple was engaged a while, they had already purchased bedroom sets and things like that, so they could go, you know what I mean, a bedroom set and bed and things.
Myers: Did they buy those things themselves?
Jones: They'd buy - between the most of them, yeah.
Myers: They bought them?
Jones: They bought them or someone would give them to them. Sometimes mother and father would give them to them, and the family would give them to them as presents.
Myers: Did they have to get their parents' permission before they were married. Did they get their parents' permission? Before they were married, their parents told them it was alright?
Jones: Well, mostly, yes, mostly had to ask their fathers and mothers because they were round eighteen, nineteen years old, some of them were young, see. Some of them had to get their parents' permission, some of them didn't. Very few ever ran away that I know of, but there was quite a few didn't have weddings or anything, they just went and got married and come back.
Myers: Went to the church? Were there any home weddings?
Jones: Didn't have any - they'd probably go to the minister’ s home or someplace like that, see.
Myers: Did any of them get married at their homes, at their parents' homes?
Jones: Oh yes, they had them in their homes, too, they had weddings in their home.
Myers: Do you recall what ages they were when they were married - were there some that were very young?
Jones: Well, between eighteen and twenty-five, eighteen or twenty-five - that run about the same as it does now.
Myers: Did people believe that it was necessary that they have a house right away when they got married?
Jones: Not always.
Myers: Some of them did, and some didn't?
Jones: Not always, they would rent along the Brandywine, if there was anything open or they went into town further and rented, know what I mean.
Myers: Do you think that most of them had a steady job? Did most of the people have a steady job when they were married?
Jones: Most of them got married around there worked for the DuPont Company.
Myers: So they had a steady job?
Jones: And they lived right there, see.
Myers: So they had a steady job of course and made a certain amount of money?
Jones: Most of the time the men had either finished their trade and were working in the tin shop or a trade like machinist or carpenter shop, anything like that. And they had their job, then they rented the Company houses.
Myers: Let's talk about the times when babies would come along, when a baby would be born to a couple – a baby, a baby.
Jones: Well, some of them would have children first year, after they were married, some of them would be two or three years before they have them, but they mostly all started families pretty quick.
Myers: Do you recall any incidents of having babies before they were married?
Jones: No.
Myers: In the Henry Clay area?
Jones: No, there wasn't any that I know of, I don't remember any of them having babies before they were married.
Myers: Before - before. Well, when a baby was going to arrive, what did they get together for that baby, what items?
Jones: Well, they got baby sweaters and things for babies to sleep in, nightgowns, things like that. It's according to whether it was a girl or boy, according to what color.
Myers: How about diapers - diapers, did they make them or did they buy them?
Jones: Neighbors?
Myers: No, diapers.
Jones: Oh - they bought them, but they didn't buy like they do now, they weren't the throwaway type, they had to wash them. See they were made of what was the old time diaper made of - flannel wasn't it?
Myers: Muslin, muslin?
Jones: Muslin, something like that. They were square, you buy them square, but some women bought the goods and cut them out and hemmed them up, see.
Myers: Were the babies nursed, or did they feed them with a bottle?
Jones: Yes.
Myers: Which - or both?
Jones: Most mothers nursed their babies up for a certain length of time, then they put them on the bottle.
Myers: Do you know what was in the formula - the formula?
Jones: Yes, I don't just remember the formula, but what's the name that Marylyn had? Similax?
Myers: Similax. What was that?
Jones: Similax it's called. But most of them, the doctor would tell them what to do about the milk, and most of them was pure cows' milk at that time, wasn't any trouble about it, the way they are now, you know what I mean, because the people wasn't – the man delivered the milk in the morning in a milk wagon, his name was Ball years ago.
Myers: Let's talk about the neighborhood, let's take the whole neighborhood, can you recall some of th enames, the local names that were used in the neighborhood?
Jones: Yes, up in Miss Mary's woods behind the C.I.D. House, there was an awfully large rock where we played. Then there was another rock down on the Brandywine just this side of the old covered bridge, between the covered bridge and the DuPont Works, or the dam. It was called Indian Rock, that's where we used to swim, it was very deep.
Myers: And what was it called?
Jones: Indian Rock, we always said we were going swimming in the Indian, you know what I mean.
Myers: Can you think of anything else, any other names? Can you recall any other names?
Jones: No, I don't believe so, no.
Myers: Did you lock your doors at night - did you lock your doors at night?
Jones: Sometimes, sometimes no.
Myers: You had locks?
Jones: Just according, if we thought of it.
Myers: Did everyone have locks on their doors?
Jones: We never had any robberies, there wasn't any crime around there. I don't know - it was the kind of a place where - I don't remember of any crime -even among kids or boys. Greatest crimes we ever committed was going up above Greenville and getting in an apple tree and try to get apples and things like that, that's the only thing.
Myers: But you don't recall anybody's home being burglarized? No burglars?
Jones: Oh no, I don't think they knew what it was outside of the powder mill explosions, you know what I mean.
Myers: No burglars?
Jones: I told my wife some time ago that it wasn't until I left Wilmington, that we ever talked about murder much.
Myers: Did your friends come to the front door or the backdoor?
Jones: Front door.
Myers: The front door, always the front door?
Jones: Front door always. - Traveling peddlers; Magazines and newspapers; Story about his uncle; NicknamesKeywords: "Herald World"; "Inquirer Press"; "Ladie's Home Journal"; "New York Sun"; "New York Times"; "New York Tribune"; "Philadelphia Inquirer"; "Philadelphia North American" "Wilmington Every Evening"; "Philadelphia Press"; "Popular Mechanics"; "Saturday Evening Post"; "Wilmington Journal"' "Wilmington Morning News"; Coronets; Nicknames; Peddlers; Street-railroadsTranscript: Myers: Do you remember the peddlers, the peddlers who came into your village? People who came...do you recall...
Jones: Now - I was just coming to that myself. We had all kinds of peddlers. We had a man who peddled images.
Myers: What?
Jones: Images - like religious images, you know what I mean.
Myers: Oh, images - statues?
Jones: Some of them sort of statues like, small and like that. And there was also - also we had a lady that came to our house, her name was Mrs. Carpenter, she always wore real black, long skirts and scarf around her throat and she had a basket, about that - that she carried on her arm. It opened up and in it was notions - needles, cotton, everything that women used to sew on the sewing machine, you know what I mean, like catches and stuff like that that they put on their dresses.
Myers: Buttons?
Jones: Buttons, anything like that she sold. She came about every three or four months she would make a visit to the Brandywine, stop at my Mother's and my Mother used to buy a lot of stuff off her, cause she made dresses for my sister, see.
Myers: She went to every house?
Jones: She went from house to house and I guess she made quite a bit of money.
Myers: Where did she come from?
Jones: Wilmington.
Myers: Wilmington.
Jones: Come out of Wilmington.
Myers: She would come out on the trolley car?
Jones: She come out on a streetcar. And would walk up -she'd get off at Rising Sun and walk all through the Village, all the way up.
Myers: Do you recall her name?
Jones: Her name was Carpenter.
Myers: Carpenter. Her first name?
Jones: No, it was just Mrs. Carpenter. She was evidently a widow, because she - at the time I knew her – I would say she was in her fifties.
Myers: Do you recall any other peddlers?
Jones: Other peddlers - yes there was the pie man that peddled pies.
Myers: What kind of pies?
Jones: Ned Edler was his name.
Myers: What - apple pies?
Jones: All kinds of pies he sold, all kinds. His mother baked them and he would come through selling.
Myers: Where did he live, did he...
Jones: He lived across the Brandywine in...he was over at Walkers Banks.
Myers: Walkers Banks - the pie man lived on Walkers Banks.
Jones: He lived over in Walkers Banks, that's across the Brandywine.
Myers: Did he come in a wagon, a horse and wagon?
Jones: He walked across the Brandywine at the covered bridge.
Myers: How did he carry those pies.
Jones: He delivered his pies to people that wanted to buy them, you know what I mean.
Myers: Did he have a wagon, a wagon?
Jones: He had a flat thing, he carried it with his arm, on his arm that way.
Myers: A basket?
Jones: Wasn't a basket, no, it was just like a flat board that you would put strawberries in.
Myers: With a handle on it, a strap or a handle?
Jones: He kept a cover over it.
Myers: Cover over it, and how did he carry that?
Jones: I don't know how he did that, but he would carry - it was like that with a handle on it and he had a hand it that way.
Myers: A handle in the center of the board?
Jones: And he would come up to the door, show what kind of pies he had, they would buy most of them for the children, cause they were small. They were small pies, they weren't big.
Myers: The flat board, where was the handle?
Jones: Just a flat board with sides on it to keep the pies from sliding off.
Myers: And the handle?
Jones: And the handle over the center of it.
Myers: Center - okay, thank you. Did you take any magazines or newspapers?
Jones: Well, most of the magazines were purchased at either the drugstore - and the newspapers were delivered by a family by the name of Lundy. Lundy had the newspapers all through the Village, but the magazines at that time were very few and far between.
Myers: Do you remember the names of the magazines? The names of the magazines?
Jones: I'm not so sure I remember the - oh I know a mechanic magazine that...
Woman: Popular Mechanics?
Jones: "Popular Mechanics” , that was one you could get at the drugstore. "Popular Mechanics" and movie magazines, anything like that, like they have now. They were, oh, "Saturday Evening Post” , that was the main buy. And "Ladies Home Journal" was another one, that's the only ones I can remember.
Myers: How about the newspapers? Which...
Jones: They had every kind of newspaper under the sun at that time.
Myers: Can you tell me the names?
Jones: Yes, Mam - "Inquirer Press."
Myers: Philadelphia "Inquirer" - "Inquirer?"
Jones: "Inquirer" - "Philadelphia Inquirer” , "Philadelphia Press", "Philadelphia North American", "Wilmington Every Evening", "Wilmington Journal."
Myers: What was the last one?
Jones: "Wilmington Journal” , and "Wilmington Morning News" and then there was a New York paper, "Herald World" and "Tribune" and "Sun" and "New York Times."
Myers: And you were able to get all of them, where did you get all of those newspapers?
Jones: We only took the "Journal."
Myers: You took the "Journal", but the others were available?
Jones: Well, will you stop the recorder a minute?
Myers: No, we can let it keep going, you keep talking.
Jones: My uncle used to be a - he was killed on the rail-road - but he used be a Western Union boy before he got married, and this was his spiel as he went through the train - "Inquirer â € ” Post time – Herald World Tribune and Sun and all the latest magazines. Little railroad lantern for the babies filled with candy." And then he wound up with, "Hershey bar.” That's what he used to sing.
Myers: Hershey bar, u-huh, okay. Do you remember any nick-names for the people that you knew in that village? Did any of them have nicknames - nicknames?
Jones: Names?
Myers: Nick.
Jones: Oh yes.
Myers: Tell me about some of them.
Jones: I was Corny.
Myers: What's that?
Jones: My name was Corny, cause I played the coronet. My brother was named Fiddler because he played a Violin.
Myers: What was your brother's name?
Jones: He never liked it so I don't know whether I should use it or not.
Myers: What was his name?
Jones: His name was Wilmer D. Jones, he's my oldest brother, he's out to the Episcopal Home, he's the oldest one. Then there was Tuffy Gallagher, he and I played together all the time.
Myers: How did the people get those nicknames?
Jones: It was just - well how come Tuffy, we'll say Tuffy got his name? Because he was - he wasn't a bad boy, he wasn't a bully, but you couldn't hurt him and they called him Tuffy, know what I mean. Because we used to play Leader and one of the things we done was hang by our hands on the railroad trestle, like that. Go down through the ties between and hang there until the leader come up himself and Tuffy could hang there longer than anybody. - Getting haircuts and styling hair; Getting grazed by a stray bullet; Brandywine ghost stories; Explosions at Hagley YardKeywords: Barbershops; Explosions; Ghost Stories; Hagley Yard; Haircuts; Wigs; Wilmington, Del.Transcript: Myers: Where did you get your hair cut - hair cut?
Jones: Well of course when I was young I had bobbed hair, but when I started getting it cut, we went to a man by the name, on 4th Street, my Father took me to a man by the name of Hillbebber.
Myers: What's that?
Jones: His name was Hillbebber in on 4th Steeet, and then we started to go to Joe Lemon on 4th Street.
Myers: Did the women go there too?
Jones: Huh?
Myers: Did women go there?
Jones: Women?
Myers: Where did the women go?
Jones: Just the men, there was no women went. This lady hair business only come up in later years.
Myers: The women, did the women have a shop too?
Jones: Did women have jobs?
Myers: A shop where they got their hair fixed?
Jones: I don't remember any. I don't remember any hair dressing shops for women. Not when I was young, they did their own hair.
Myers: Did any of them have short hair or did most of them have long hair?
Jones: Most of them with long hair. My Mother always plaited hers at night in the back, all the way down to her waist. Most had a lot of hair and they put it up in a knot like that on top of the head, know what I mean. I don't remember any women's shop at that time.
Myers: So did they curl their hair - curl it?
Jones: Oh yes.
Myers: How?
Jones: They used pieces of rag. Some of them had kid, sewed up kid that they rolled their hair up into - the wire was covered with kid to keep from tearing the hair. They rolled it up like that and bent over. Yes, the mothers used to put the girls hair up that way. I don't think there was any of it went on in my childhood. I don't remember any of them dyeing their hair or anything like that at that time. There was only one or two women that for some unfortunate reason they lost their hair when they had a child. And they used to wear a cap made until they had a hair wig made. And when they went out on Sunday or something, but I don't know where they went to get it, but some of them it seemed, there was a couple I knew that had that trouble. After the children were born they lost their hair almost, you know what I mean, almost bald, see.
Myers: Did it grow back?
Jones: Not that I know of.
Myers: You mean they lost it forever, it didn't grow back?
Jones: They lost it, I guess they lost it forever, cause they had wigs made.
Myers: They had wigs made. The hair never - the hair didn't come back?
Jones: In the daytime, around the house when they worked and everything, they wore like a night cap, you know what I mean, like a bathing cap, well like you use for a shower or a bath.
Myers: A lot of the women lost their hair, or a few?
Jones: Not a lot. I don't know what caused them to lose their hair, but I do know that, because of childbirth. And in fact, one of the women was Grace Toy's sister-in-law. She married Grace Toy's brother and she lost her hair.
Myers: What was her name, do you remember?
Jones: Her name was Toy.
Myers: No, she married Grace Toy's brother, what was...
Jones: Brother - she married Grace Toy's brother.
Myers: What was her maiden name?
Jones: I don't know what it was because they were married before my time.
Myers: Before your time. Let's talk about the main objects in some of your rooms in your house - how about your kitchen?
Jones: In the kitchen - in one corner we kept our refrigerator, then the stove was fixed, then we had this large walnut kitchen table that all of us eat around. The windowsills at the C.I.D. house were wide like that and my Mother cooled all her bread and pies and every-thing in these windowsills cause they were cool, know what I mean. If it was summertime they could lift the window and that's where I almost got killed, that windowsill, the one that...
Myers: What happened?
Jones: I loved ginger cake - my Mother made ginger cake and I was standing at this window where my Mother had put the ginger cake to cool, and a shot came down from up in Miss Mary's woods down and hit the window and creased my hair right down the middle.
Myers: A bullet?
Jones: A bullet, they never identified it. It was a regular bullet, went right through the window. They stood me at the window just to see how close it was barreling. It didn't - I don't think - it didn't hit me anywhere, but went over my head like that.
Myers: How old were you?
Jones: About five - five years old.
Myers: You remember that.
Jones: Oh I say I do. I remember it because I dropped the bowl when the bullet hit the - and I dropped the bowl and it broke it. My Mother thought I done it on purpose until she found out there was a bullet right there.
Myers: It really isn't funny, is it? Do you remember any ghost stories?
Jones: Any ghost stories?
Myers: Yes. Did you ever - did anyone tell you any ghost stories?
Jones: Only what my Grandfather used to tell us.
Myers: You remember anything he told you?
Jones: What he told me? Well he sometimes told the truth. He lived in a house that was supposed to be haunted and my Mother told us that her mother, before she died, told her that when they went there to live, her mother said you could hear this woman at any time of day at all, or night, she would say, (can't understand the next sentence). That was one ghost story he told and another one was, he claimed that one was true, and he also claimed this was true - he worked as a - at that time, you know, they didn't have embalming, they had ice boxes. He worked as an undertaker at that time sometimes and he went to this house to dress this man and he told the wife that the man ought to be dressed in this particular suit. She said, "He's not going to be dressed in that particular suit. I have bought a new suit for him and that's what he's going to be dressed in.” Well my Grandfathers aid, "But he asked me particularly many time if I would dress him in this suit that he had.” "Nothing doing,” she says. So he said I dressed him in the suit that she wanted him to be dressed in and put him in his casket and laid him out. And on the way home the horses wouldn't cross this bridge we had to cross. So he said I went back and told her I couldn't waste time trying to get the horses to go all the way around, about ten miles around the bridge, that he said have to bury him in that suit he wanted, cause I was afraid that's what he was doing, stopping my horses.
Myers: Stopping the horses.
Jones: He said he dressed him in the suit he wanted to be dressed in and he went right on out then, right across the bridge.
Myers: Did they try to scare you with the stories?
Jones: Oh, well no, I don't think they could scare us, you know what I mean. The only time that we might get scared at a ghost story was they would say who has the nerve to walk by themselves up to the powder yard and down.
Myers: Did they say - did anyone say there were ghosts in the powder yard?
Jones: In the powder yard? They would tell you you might run into a powder man that had blown up - if you walked up to the gates, you know what I mean, where they are now, and around that road and down. Is anybody afraid to go up there. That would be just one of the games they would play, try to scare them, know what I mean. They would say you could see all kinds of powder men up in the trees and everything else, the likes of them, try to scare you that way. But the greatest things that we had then was our fear of a mill blowing up.
Myers: Your fear of the mill blowing up.
Jones: Because all the time, mostly day in and day out, the mills were running and it was a continuous grinding. And you got to the place where you could almost tell when one was gonna go, because it would squeak, would have a squeaking noise here and there like, if it went. And then invariable go up, and most of the time it took somebody with it. Some man would be blown. The biggest explosion that I remember was the time the 36 was killed at the packing house - when the packing house blew up. I was in the - how old were you when you were in the sixth grade? I was about twelve years old when the packing house blew and I remember one boy in particular who went with it. It was little Elmer Compton. He had work in the packing house because they were a very poor family and the lived over in Chicken Alley across the Brandywine. And he was one of the ones that blew up in it. And Joe Mace's father, who lived on Low Row with us, he was killed in the same powder mill. I don't remember when Thomas McCrae's father was killed, he was killed before - I was born of course because Louisa McCrae was my age. I think he was killed when Louisa was about two or three years old. And Mrs. McCrae got married to a man by the name of Martin, she married another man, but she worked with Mr. Connibles who was Secretary of the DuPont Company. - Getting sick during the Influenza Epidemic; Important lessons from parents; Halloween; Household objects and prized possessionsKeywords: Clocks Furniture; Du Pont, Alfred I. (Alfred Irenee), 1864-1935; Halloween; Influenza Epidemic (1918-1919); Outhouses; Pneumonia; Typhoid fever; Wilmington Country ClubTranscript: Myers: Did you sometimes have bad dreams or nightmares because of the explosions?
Jones: I don't remember any - no my Grandfather had them, but I don't remember them. I don't remember ever having any. Only - not down on the Brandywine. I remember after we moved into town, we'd have them once in a while - that's the elephants on the wall.
Myers: Elephants on the wall?
Jones: But that was after I was sick with the flu, know what I mean. The doctor said that what it was do there, told my Mother that's what is causing him to be that way. See, I almost died with the flu.
Myers: How old were you then?
Jones: I was fourteen and a half. I served papers all around DuPont and this very, very - the old Wilmington Country Club. They turned it into a hospital and I used to have to take papers down there and there were caskets all along the road. And I came to Mr. Lammot's house and I come in the kitchen and put my papers down and put my head on the table and the cook asked me what was the matter. I said, "I'm awful sick, but I'll be alright in a minute. Just let me rest for a minute and then I'll go serve the rest of my papers." And just then Mrs. du Pont walked in and she asked the cook, "What is the trouble with the boy?” She says, "He's sick.” And I looked up, "Good evening, Mrs. du Pont."She says, "You're not going to serve any more papers tonight. I'm going to call the chauffeur and send you home." So she sent me home and I was sick for - all during the flu and then I took walking typhoid fever and from walking typhoid fever I went into pneumonia. It all happened in the wintertime, so the doctor wouldn't let me go to school, so I went to work up to Mr. Alfred I. du Pont's, up through Christmas and up until summer.
Myers: Do you remember the most important thing when you were growing up that your parents taught you?
Jones: Yes, he was always at us to behave ourself and not steal and not get into a lot of trouble. It was one of the most important things. Said just no crime, everything was - didn't like us to get into any crime business when we were kids, know what I mean. Of course he didn't have to tell us that because - I don't know, we didn't seem to be that way. We were mischievous, but we weren't looking for any crime or anything like that. You take the two boys I played with, Tuffy Gallagher, Paul Dougherty, both of them are dead now. The worst thing we ever did was in Halloween night was maybe turn a toilet over or something like that with a clothesline pole.
Myers: When you were a very young boy, what was the object that meant the most to you, of your possessions that you had as a young boy?
Jones: I guess the things I had was my Christmas toys that I kept, and I still have most of them down there. Trains and hook and ladders and everything like that. Of course my trumpet that my Father got for me to start music with, I cherish that quite a bit. I guess that's about the most important things, I guess that's about all.
Myers: How about your mother and your father, what was the most important possessions for both of them, do you recall?
Jones: You mean...
Myers: Your mother and your father, you cherished your Christmas toys, what in your home did your Mother cherish the most?
Jones: You mean..
Myers: Of her possessions? Do you recall that?
Jones: She liked the things we played with, like she liked my sister's doll and she made dresses for them. She used to like to see me running my trains and things like that around the house.
Myers: But something else that your mother - not your things, but her things perhaps. Your Mother’ s things. What was her favorite?
Jones: She had a boat that she kept her jewelry and stuff in.
Myers: A boat?
Jones: It was a real glass boat like, and it was Uncle Sam in the center of it, you remember the white boat? It was built like a ship, know what I mean, it was about that deep, she kept her jewelry in there and everything.
Myers: She liked that?
Jones: I think that was...
Myers: Do you have that?
Jones: No, my sister Ethel, I think, has it.
Myers: Ethel Jones Hayward has that. How about your father, what was his favorite item?
Jones: I don't know, he liked - most thing he liked he liked his cuff links and studs and things like that, know what I mean. I gave him - years ago when I was up du Ponts, when I was sick that time and worked for Mr. Alfred I., he gave me a wallet for a Christmas present. My father...
Myers: Do you remember the most popular toy that was homemade?
Jones: My teddy bear that my Mother purchased for me when...
Myers: That - now wait a minute, I want you to tell me about homemade toys, homemade.
Jones: Oh, it was - she purchased in town. We didn't have any, she purchased most all of our toys, outside of what we made ourselves. We made our own waterwheels, know what I mean, out of spools and made waterwheels out of them, that was one of the popular things we played with. We set them up where there was a run or something like that, know what I mean, and hook them up together. Maybe be a half a dozen waterwheels running at one time.
Myers: And then the store bought toys - was the teddy bear?
Jones: My teddy bear was the greatest one. It was - I had it from the time I- see my Mother purchased it – the first teddy bears was made the year I was born.
Myers: What year was that?
Jones: 1903 and I guess my Mother bought it when I was about two years old. And I slept with it until I was six or seven, same toy.
Myers: Do you remember the object in your house, the most beautiful object in your house?
Jones: I can't say - the clock, and these chairs. The one on your mantle right here in your own home. Like I said, one of the most important things, the clock and these two chairs here from there.
Myers: Those chairs - the chair you're sitting on?
Jones: This one and that one over there.
Myers: These you used in the C.I.D. house?
Jones: In the C.I.D. house.
Myers: The chair you're Sitting in and the rocker?
Jones: In the front room, in our front living room.
Myers: I see, the ones right here in your living room, these were used in the C.I.D. house?
Jones: Is this too, and a rocker and a couch. Remember they had an old time couch.
Myers: What was the most expensive object - the one that costs the most money?
Jones: Well the most expensive - I couldn't say unless it was the clock.
Myers: This clock on the mantle?
Jones: I don't know what my Father paid for it.
Myers: You don't recall how much that costs? Will you describe that clock, will you please describe that clock?
Jones: Well, it's made - I don't know, it was something that most everybody liked when they came to the house, most everybody liked that clock. Because it had this horse on top of it, the horse lost its tail, fell off and broke or something, but it was an object that everybody went over and talk and everything like that, they seemed to know when to go home or anything like that, looked up at the clock.
Woman: That clock chimes every fifteen minutes.
Jones: Every fifteen minutes.
Myers: Did you ever have to have it repaired? Did it ever break down?
Jones: Few times I had it repaired. When I first came home from the Service, I had it repaired. And then I had it repaired two more times after that. Because it was dirty because they had put it up on the mantle piece above the fireplace at the Hamilton Street House.
Myers: Can you tell me how old that clock is?
Jones: No I can't, but it's as old as I am.
Myers: How about that chair and the rocking chair?
Jones: They're seventy-five or more years old. I was only a small child when my Mother purchased them.
Myers: The one you're sitting in, here in your living room, and the rocking chair in the living room, both were used in the...
Jones: Both of these, she purchased them at one time.
Myers: Where did she get them?
Jones: I think they were purchased from, I don't know whether she purchased them from McMann or not. - Household objects; Bathing and hygieneKeywords: Axes; Baths; C.I.D. House; Coffee pots; Hygiene; Irons (Pressing); Kettles; Mouse traps; Oil lamps; Pans; Soapstone; Telephones; VerminTranscript: Myers: I'm going to ask you a number of questions about various things that you might - may or may not have had in your home. The first one - did you have an axe?
Jones: Oh yes, my Father had an axe.
Myers: More than one -one, two, three?
Jones: Well he had - he had several axes - he had two axes and also he had sledge - you know what I mean, to split wood with.
Myers: What was that called?
Jones: Wedges, wedges. When he would open, he would drive a wedge into a log that was cut for a stove, drive those wedges in, that would split it open.
Myers: And what was that made of?
Jones: Steel, steel wedges.
Myers: Where did you keep that?
Jones: My Father kept them right in the shed outside the house.
Myers: Did you have a muffin tin - muffin tin?
Jones: She had smaller cake pans, you know what I mean, but I guess they used them for muffins then, you know what I mean.
Myers: A coffee pot?
Jones: Coffee pot - it was made of - first coffee pot that I remember was made of - what do you call it – it would chip.
Myers: Porcelain.
Jones: Porcelain.
Myers: What did it look like?
Jones: Well it was - would hold about two quarts and shaped like the old time coffee pot, you know what I mean, slanted down like that, top with a lid, handle on it, and you boiled the coffee in the coffee, put it right in the bottom of the pot and boiled it. Put egg shells in to keep them settled, know what I mean.
Myers: Did the coffee pot have a design on it, a picture on it?
Jones: Had a spout on it.
Myers: Yes, did it have a picture on it, or was it a solid color?
Jones: Picture, I don’ t have a picture of it.
Myers: No, did the coffee pot have a picture on it? Or a design.
Jones: I don't remember.
Myers: Did you have a kettle - a kettle - a tea kettle?
Jones: Oh yes, an agate kettle.
Myers: A big one?
Jones: Big, yes, well it wasn't too big, but she kept it mostly filled, know what I mean, on the back part of the stove. Then they also had a - the stove also had a place to put water in.
Myers: A dish pan - a dish pan.
Jones: Pan - oh we had a dish pan, yeah, had a dish pan.
Myers: Would you describe that - describe the dish pan.
Jones: Well, it was about eight inches deep and about, I'd say it was about as big around as the top of that table.
Myers: About two feet?
Jones: And it was deep, that's what they scrubbed all their dishes in.
Myers: Did you have a towel rack?
Jones: We had a towel rack, we had a towel rack. When we washed the dishes, we would spread one towel down to put them on and then when we were through scrubbing the dishes, we would throw that water out and put new water in and rinse them, rinse the dishes off and wipe them. Maybe take four towels for dinner.
Myers: A wash tub?
Jones: Oh yes, we had two wash tubs, pretty good size.
Myers: How big? How big?
Jones: They were at least three foot in diameter, two and a half to three foot in diameter, big enough for we kids to take a bath in.
Myers: How many - more than one at a time could get in?
Jones: Well, we had the bench in the basement, they were on a bench and my Mother used them, you know what I mean, washed there.
Myers: One at a time.
Jones: Washed there. She rinsed - she had two tubs, one to rinse in and one to wash in.
Myers: And how often did you take a bath?
Jones: Once a week.
Myers: Once a week.
Jones: Saturday night, that was a ritual.
Myers: Saturday night you got in the tub?
Jones: Had to run out into the shed and scrub off in the cold shed with the warm water, and then throw a towel around us and run into the stove and warm up and then up to bed and hit the bed where yo uhad the feather bed, you know what I mean.
Myers: And warm up. Did you have a fluting iron?
Jones: Not that I remember.
Myers: Did you have a Mason jar - Mason jar?
Jones: Oh yes, yes. I was just telling her before you came, we had three big Mason jars like, like I say, they were - you would say they were at least five gallons a piece. My Mother used them to make pickle in one, the other she made blackberry jam, and also those little apples - what's the name of those apples - pears, pears - sickle pears, she used to make spiced sickle pears in one - used to pick it up and let them eat it.
Myers: Did you have a Sears catalog - Sears catalog?
Jones: We didn't use Sears and Roebuck, no.
Myers: No catalog? Did you have the catalog?
Jones: No, we didn't deal with Sears & Roebuck at all, not at that time that I remember.
Myers: Did you have a mouse trap - a mouse trap?
Jones: We had two of them, a cat and a regular mouse trap.
Myers: Did you have a lot of mice?
Jones: No, because my Mother always kept a very nice mouser. The cat took care of them. She used to make me sick passing by he door with amouse in her teeth.
Myers: She did what?
Jones: She used to make me almost sick to see her going out past the door with a mouse in her teeth, outside, you know what I mean, they ate it.
Myers: The cat. Did you have a telephone, a wall telephone?
Jones: We didn't have any telephone on the Brandywine, the only telephone on the Brandywine was storekeepers had them. You could go call up on the phone, but none in the houses, not at the time that we lived there. They might have come later, but not at the time that we lived there.
Myers: What year did you leave the C.I.D. house? When did you leave that house?
Jones: When did we leave it - the house up there? I think it was around 1916.
Myers: 1916. Did you have a coat rack?
Jones: We had a closet - we had nice closets in that house.
Myers: Did you have a hat rack?
Jones: Hatrack above it, yeah.
Myers: In the closet, but not separate?
Jones: In the closet where we kept clothes.
Myers: Did you have an oil lamp - a lamp with oil?
Jones: We had oil lamps.
Myers: How many?
Jones: Mother had two for the kitchen, one for - and two for the front room, they were living room lamps, and another smaller lamp that she carried upstairs to put in the hall at night for bed.
Myers: Who took care of the lamps - who lit the lamps? Who cleaned them?
Jones: Mother cleaned them.
Myers: Who cleaned them or lit them - did you light them?
Jones: We never had any lights like that, only thing we did our lessons by was oil, oil - oil lights.
Myers: Whose jobs was it to light the lamps? Light the lamps?
Jones: My Father and Mother.
Myers: The children did not?
Jones: Children didn't do it, no. We didn't have one of them.
Myers: Did you have a soapstone griddle?
Jones: No we didn't have one. - Household objectsKeywords: Almanacs; Beeswax; Farmers' Almanac; Furniture; Irons (Pressing); Kitchen tools; Matches; Milk deliveries; StovesTranscript: Myers: A cherry pitter - a cherry pitter?
Jones: No, we pitted them by hand.
Myers: You didn't have - you did them by hand.
Jones: Oh, no, I'm wrong, my Mother had one. You could pit the cherries with and also it was a combination where you could put a meat grinder on it and everything like that.
Myers: What did it look like, the cherry pitter?
Jones: It was an oval shaped thing with a place to put the cherries into and when you wound the handle, the cherry pits would stay in this thing and the cherry part would fall down through it, know what I mean, like a sieve.
Myers: Did you have a trivet - a trivet - an iron ring or a trivet?
Jones: No.
Myers: A cabbage slicer - cabbage slicer.
Jones: Cabbage - hand slicing.
Myers: Did you cut the cabbage by hand?
Jones: Of course you could run cabbage through the meat grinder because it had all kinds of things to attach to it. If you wanted to make coleslaw, you could run pieces of cabbage through it.
Myers: Did you have an almanac - almanac?
Jones: Yes, well the old Farmers' Almanac. My Father used to bring the old Farmers' Almanac from town all the time.
Myers: You did not have a Green's Almanac - you didn't have a Green's Almanac, but you had a Farmers' Almanac.
Jones: I've heard of them, but we never had, we had the old Farmers’ Almanac.
Myers: Did you have a highchair - a highchair?
Jones: Oh yes, we had a highchair. It was a highchair and a rocking chair. You put it down to where you could make a rocker out of it, like to put the child in.
Myers: How did that work - describe that to me.
Jones: Its legs were - you stood it up and put the baby in the house there, but if you wanted to put it down, put the side down, then it had a thing that opened like and the legs would, legs would breakdown like that, and they rocked like a cradle, was a combination.
Myers: Oh, I see.
Jones: The baby could rock in it like that.It was a highchair and a cradle like.
Myers: It was a highchair and a rocker you might say, combination. Did you have a butter mold – butter molds?
Jones: We had butter molds, yes, butter molds yes.
Myers: Describe that.
Jones: It was in a pound size with a mold on top of it, made an impression in the butter like.
Myers: You had an ice box - did you have an ice box?
Jones: Yes, we had an ice box.
Myers: What did it look like?
Jones: Well, it had a place for the ice and then on the other side, right next to the ice, was a place to keep things cold, like butter and milk and stuff like that. Then down underneath you had two different sections to keep your meat and all different things, it was quite a nice sized box. It was about, well I would say, it was at least five foot high.
Myers: Did you have an egg beater? Egg Beater?
Jones: Oh, an egg beater, yeah. My Mother had eggbeaters.
Myers: What did it look like?
Jones: Sort of a rachet on it, you know what I mean, with a - sort of like that, went around like that. And then she also had those wire beaters. Like a whisk.
Myers: Did you have a pitcher - a pitcher?Jones: Pitcher?
Myers: Pitcher, that's right.
Jones: We had two of them. On that we sit out on the windowsill to get milk, man left a little over a quart of milk in this pitcher, out on the windowsill with a cover over it - the milkman. Then we had, we had a pitcher that my Mother used to make batter, you know what I mean, for hot cakes and stuff like that.
Myers: Did you have a carving fork? A carving fork?
Jones: Coffee - milk?
Myers: Carving fork.
Jones: Carving - oh, yes, sure. Sure, with the carving knife.
Myers: Is that what you used.
Jones: They're old, they're older than I am, the carving knives. We had carving knife, fork and also that steel.
Myers: A table - table. Did you have a table?
Jones: We didn't have a carving table, we had a carving block.
Myers: No, did you have a table?
Jones: Oh yes, we had a table, yes.
Myers: I meant, describe the table.
Jones: The kitchen table? It was made of walnut – had leaves - it was oval like, had leaves, two leaves to put in to make it wider. It was a very nice table because it was solid walnut.
Myers: What did the legs look like? The legs of the table.
Jones: Like, you know what I mean, slanted like most tables, round in the center, two of them. Two big ones, they were on the side see and then...
Myers: Like Duncan Phyfe or...
Jones: No, oblong. It had four legs, big round legs like that, two here and two here and then the sections sort of flat, like that.
Myers: I see. Did you have a stool, a stool?
Jones: We had several, several stools, small, you know what I mean. Some of them were larger than others.
Myers: Did you have a cook stove?
Jones: Cook Stove? Yeah.
Myers: Can you tell me about that?
Jones: Well, one I remember in particular was Ogden cook stove, the old Ogden. It had a water jacket, place to keep things warm on the back of the stove, then a place for either coal or wood.
Myers: Did you have a stove lid lifter?
Jones: We had a stove lifter, yeah. Lift the lids up, you know what I mean.
Myers: What was that made of?
Jones: Steel, same as the stove, you know what I mean, only it had a, it wasn't a solid handle, it was - keep it cool, air would go through the handle like, it was shaped like that.
Myers: Did you have an iron: an iron?
Jones: Three of them.
Myers: Describe those please.
Jones: Like yours - your iron over there.
Myers: Tell me what they looked like.
Jones: Well, they were about, I guess they were about, she has a baby iron over there. They were quite heavy and had an iron holder, you know what I mean?
Myers: A handle?
Jones: Handle, was a wooden handle that punched into the iron and you would change it from one iron to the other, like when one was getting hot, you'd be ironing with the other iron. They were quite heavy, made of steel. They didn't have any water in them.
Myers: How did you get them hot?
Jones: On the stove. And they used beeswax to keep them from sticking to the clothes.
Myers: What did that look like, the bees wax?
Jones: My Mother used to buy the bees wax and wrap it into a piece of muslin and run it on the iron that way, to clean the iron. Wrap it in the muslin, then clean the iron that way. The heat of the iron would melt a little was over the iron.
Myers: Did you have an iron heater - iron heater?
Jones: Just the kitchen stove was the...
Myers: A match keeper - match keeper?
Jones: Match - well we had bullheaded matches we used, bullheaded matches come in a box like that, square box about this wide and that long.
Myers: Where did you keep them?
Jones: Up where we kept the kitchen , right over the stove.
Myers: In what, what did you keep them in? Matches?
Jones: Right on the mantle, back of the stove.
Myers: In a container?
Jones: They were in a box, you bought them in a large a large box of them like that. - Household objects; Photographs from "The Worker's World at Hagley"Keywords: "The Workers' World at Hagley" by Glenn Porter; Chairs; Churns; Clocks; Coffee Grinders; Dry sinks; Du Pont, Alfred I. (Alfred Irenee), 1864-1935; Hats; Ironing boards; Joseph Bancroft and Sons Co.; Laundry; Lunches; Medicine Chests; Photographs; Singer sewing machine; Spice boxes; Tancopanican BandTranscript: Myers: Did you have a wooden churn - churn, churn?
Jones: No, we didn't have one, no.
Myers: You didn't have one. Did you have an ironing board?
Jones: My Mother had an ironing board, yeah. She had a regular ironing board that she laid on top of the table and did her ironing, it wasn't one of them kind that had legs on it. She ironed - it was just the ironing board itself with a cover on it.
Myers: Clothespins?
Jones: She had Clothespins for hanging the clothes up outside.
Myers: Did you have a spice box?
Jones: We had a spice box and a salt box and sugar box and all of those kind of things were on there.
Myers: Did you have a wash board?
Jones: Two of them.
Myers: And what did they look like?
Jones: They were about, I guess they were probably a foot and a half wide, maybe a foot and a half deep with two legs on it, you put it in the tub and it had a regular corrugated thing that you scrubbed on like that.
Myers: Did you have a dry sink - dry sink?
Jones: No.
Myers: A coffee grinder?
Jones: Oh yes, I still have it - I don’ t have it, my daughter has it.
Myers: What does it look like?
Jones: Well it was, it was square, and it had a place to adjust the grind of the coffee you wanted to grind. You put the coffee in a place below that, the coffee bean, and you ground it around like that, and it had a drawer to catch what you were grinding. My daughter has it now, the old coffee grinder we had, my daughter has it.
Myers: Did you have a wringer - for wringing the clothes?
Jones: Yeah, my Mother had a wringer - my Mother's hands was the wringer.
Myers: She would wring the clothes with her hands?
Jones: Sheets and everything, yeah. She never had a wringer that I know of, no.
Myers: That was very hard. They worked hard in those days.
Jones: Yes, I'm sure - I know they did.
Myers: Did you have a wooden bucket, a wooden bucket?
Jones: Oh yes, we had several of those.
Myers: Did you have a boot jack - boot jack?
Jones: No.
Myers: You did not have a boot jack?
Jones: No, we didn't have one.
Myers: Did you have a lamp with kerosene - kerosene lamp?
Jones: Kerosene lamp, yeah. We had kerosene lamps.
Myers: A hat, a bowler hat, did you have one? Bowler Hat.
Jones: I didn't, my Father did, but I didn't have one. I must have wore a cap.
Myers: What did that bowler hat look like?
Jones: Something like the old fashioned derby. In fact, there it is right here.
Myers: In "The Workers' World", we saw them in the "Workers' World."
Jones: Yes, yes, like the derby.
Myers: I'd like to go back to "The Workers' World" -in "The Workers World" you pointed out your Father in one of those pictures - what page was that?
Jones: He's on two pages there.
Myers: On two pictures?
Jones: He's in the orchestra - Tancopanican Orchestra.
Myers: In the what?
Jones: Here's a picture right here. My Uncle and my Father.
Myers: What page is that?
Jones: Thirty-six is one and on the other - that's my Father there, and that's my Uncle. That's the old Tancopanican Orchestra.
Myers: What instruments are they playing - what instruments?
Jones: He played the violin.
Myers: Your father?
Jones: My Father and Uncle both played the violin.
Myers: What was your uncle's name? Your uncle's name?
Jones: Evan - Evan Jones - his name was Evan - he only worked for DuPont's for a short while and then he went to Bancroft's, he worked at Bancroft's. Try to find my father's picture.
Myers: The gate, the entrance...
Jones: At the gate.
Myers: Yes, and your father, you pointed out that he was also in that picture in "The Workers' World" – the "No Admittance" gate.
Jones: I think it's on the front - Mary Elaine has that picture.
Myers: The "No Admittance" gate picture, on Page 60 in "The Workers' World” , you told me your father is in that picture.
Jones: This one here, the one with the straw hat.
Myers: The second man from the left?
Jones: Has a straw hat.
Myers: Let's go on. You had a lunch bucket - a lunch bucket - did you have a lunch bucket?
Jones: You mean our lunch?
Myers: Yes, what did you have one there in your home?
Jones: Maybe a piece of apple - apple and - we all had a lunch box to take to school with us.
Myers: What did it look like?
Jones: And my Father had a lunch box.
Myers: What did they look like?
Jones: In fact the one that's in here, could take a hot and cold dish in it, you know what I mean.
Myers: Made out of what - what was it made of?
Jones: Made of tin I guess.
Myers: Ice tongs, ice tongs?
Jones: Yeah, we had ice tongs.
Myers: Did you have a straight chair, a chair that was straight at the back?
Jones: You mean a big Santa?
Myers: Straight...
Jones: Oh, a straight chair? Like that one, something like that one there.
Myers: Did you have a straight chair?
Jones: That's not one of them, but something like that, we had several of them in the front room.
Myers: Did you have a medicine chest, medicine chest?
Jones: Medicine chest? Yes, my Mother had it. My Mother kept it away from we kids. She had - she kept it up high.
Myers: Did you have another - did you have a shelf clock other than this one in your home now?
Jones: Do I have a - well, we had another clock we kept in the kitchen, and I have it in my bedroom.
Myers: Was that on a shelf?
Jones: High and...
Myers: Did that sit on a shelf?
Jones: Kept it on the shelf, right over the stove.
Myers: Would you please describe that?
Jones: Well, it had a round face on it like that and a pendulum that you could see working, in the door, with the words "Time is Money", but that's all gone off of it now, it was "Time is Money" and it also had an alarm in it that you could set the alarm by setting the thing in the center of the clock, on the face of the clock, at the time you wanted the alarm to go off, and you wound it at the face, you would the alarm and also the time.
Myers: Did you have a milk can - a milk can - milk?
Jones: Milk can, no, we had pitchers we kept our milk in.
Myers: Did you mother sew, did she sew?
Jones: She sewed, yes, she had a Singer sewing machine.
Myers: Did she have a lap board for sewing?
Jones: No.
Myers: She didn't?
Jones: She used the sewing machine thing.
Myers: Did you have a tea kettle? Tea Kettle?
Jones: Sorry to make you get up so much, Mrs. Meyer.
Myers: That's alright.
Jones: Oh yes, we had a tea kettle. We had a tea kettle that was about - it would hold about a couple of quarts, you know what I mean, with a spout. It was made of agate.
Myers: Did you have a bean pot or casserole? Casserole?
Jones: No, no - my Mother had covered dishes.
Myers: That's kind of a casserole.
Jones: My sister has one up there, oh something like a casserole.
Myers: But you did have something like a casserole?
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